saginaw m1 carbine markingsnational mental health awareness

The technical storage or access is necessary for the legitimate purpose of storing preferences that are not requested by the subscriber or user. The top front of the receiver is marked U.S. Ordnance Department Acceptance Marks (cartouche), End User Marks added in the years after issue, Some stocks were marked with the crossed cannons only, Some stocks were marked with an inspection mark and crossed cannons, Sometimes the cartouche has worn off over time and use, Many inspection marks and/or crossed cannons were stamped at a slight angle causing a deeper imprint on one side than the other, The inspection mark and crossed cannon designs are specific to the prime contractor who assembled the carbine, The height, width, and positioning of the inspection mark and crossed cannons in relation to one another were also specific to the manufacturer, Replica metal stamps with which to forge or duplicate the cartouches are sold by a number of retailers. The bottom of the grip is marked with a circled P proof. Our Assessment:The M1 Carbine was developed and produced after WWII started. The Irwin-Pedersen contracts were terminated by Ordnance. The stock was also replaced and has no proof markings. two Ordnance rebuild P's. Questions should be posted in the appropriate forum. They show light scrapes & areas of discoloration from oxidation. Location: The People's Glorious Republik of Southern Kalifornistan. They didn't come any other way--period. There is minor wear concentrated around the high edges of the receiver. They now sell for $4.50 to $7.00 each. Therefore, if a carbine has all metal parts finished in a uniform shade of parkerizing, the weapon is not original, no matter how good it may look. barrel channel (top) The technical storage or access is required to create user profiles to send advertising, or to track the user on a website or across several websites for similar marketing purposes. Markings per component: -Barrel Bands -Type 1 (Early Narrow Band) -Inland: Marked "UI" "U" Or unmarked. Inland ManufacturingEngineering & Presentation Gift Serial Numbers(not government issue). The top of the barrel is marked UNDERWOOD / 9 43 and P. This bridge was eliminated with all M2 stocks and removed from earlier stocks later converted Lock, Stock & Barrel Investments GENERAL MOTORS 12-43. A number of researchers and authors are present on the forums, helping others and seeking information for various research projects. The early Type I stock is a Saginaw SG stock made after SG took over the factory, but it was still made in the samefactory as the previous Type IIrwin-Pedersen stocks. We would like to encourage you to share information you may have that will help reconstruct what was actually done versus planned. As time goes on more and more carbines are having parts replaced. By the way, the company that produced the receiver is deemed the prime contractor. During the first half of production the barrels were often mounted on a receiver within 1-2 months of when the barrel was made. We have a The barrel is stamped UNDERWOOD on the top of the barrel behind the front sight. I've got one with (JJ) in a circle , on the flipper, on a Winchester. Rather than assume the documents were followed to the letter, the serial numbers in tables C-F are presented with the lowest and highest reported to date. community. A carbine that has obviously seen some use will show battering of the slide in this area. This rareIrwin-PedersenM1 Carbine is in Very Good Plus condition. Questions should be posted in the appropriate forum. The technical storage or access that is used exclusively for anonymous statistical purposes. Forgeries are a serious concern for collectors. No one, so far, at CMP has ID'ed it yet. another state. Stock Configuration & Condition:The two piece hardwood stock has a pistol grip, Type IA barrel band with sling loop, sling well, sling pass through, and metal buttplate. Instead of buying a gun thats There is insufficient data to determine if every serial number between the lows and highs was duplicated or if it was random. The stock rates in about Very Good Plus overall condition. All matching even the trigger group. 217: M1 Carbine Barrel Band Type 3 (Bayonet lug)Used G.I. Over 6 million were made by a number of U.S. companies to assist with the all out war effort. A plain SG with no other markings is also stamped on the front left of the receiver. Barrel Date: March, 1943, Action Type:Semi Auto, Detachable Magazine. Need Help Identifying Marks and value on My New SG M1. For the best experience on our site, be sure to turn on Javascript in your browser. service to the online gun buying experience that is unheard of. Most were of the flat top variety although the rounded bolts came into use by a few makers before production ceased. Ordnance also inspected We'rebringing a level of The best way to ensure an item is yours is to purchase it directly off the website. Numbers were issued sequentially, beginning where Many of the marks have damaged small portions of the surface wood. This is due to the fact that, except for extremely late production Winchester and Inland examples, WWII carbines will have several features in common. It makes a difference. I'm guessing this indicates a Springfield Armory rebuild. Made in the Winter of 1943. Got 1 ! The trigger group is a type two pattern with the upright Inland markings on To separate the production of each plant the prime symbol () was marked after the SG on the receivers of the Grand Rapids carbines. It is only fair that some context of time be added to such comments. I have one, 1776xxx. Receiver or barrel or? Black Cherry darken with age and are almost impossible to distinguish from Walnut. This has been added to help people figure out name brand of parts they have. Irwin-Pedersenhad assembled only 3,542 guns at the time, none of which were accepted by the government. of 0.5. It is assumed some were sequential but possibly not all. Lock, Stock & Barrel Investments 30 M1. and the top rear is marked SAGINAW SG / 3289121. Most WWII carbines had hand guards with two rivets rather than the four rivet hand guards found on later production carbines and many rebuilds. Mechanics:The action functions correctly. Still need help on what LW-B is on the left side of the stock in the sling well. During WWII the only stocks made with Birch were made by Sprague & Carleton Co. of Keene, NH for IBM (SC-B). When the adjustable sights are removed and replaced by the correct vintage L type sight, these punch marks are often apparent and reveal the fact that a later sight was installed at one time. This is not to imply thatonlythese parts are important as every component should be closely scrutinized. SIG Sauer Tango MSR Optic Review: Your Value & Performance LPVO. Waste of time. Also, have bandoliers & stripper clips & sling. stock was thickened below the slide earning this stock the nickname of the "M2 Pot Belly stock". The Underwood barrel is original. During the production of their type III stocks in 1945 Winchester changed The above hints are no substitute for a thorough examination of a carbine by someone knowledgeable on the subject. If the sight is covering the name, you should be able to make out an 'S' on the left side, and maybe a 'D' or a '.' The Type IA barrel band is marked UP which was used by Irwin-Pedersen and Saginaw SG (page 59). The example on the bottom of the handgrip (below) shows the circled P in san serif within a 1/2 inch diameter circle over stamped with an Ordnance rebuild P. Carbines having been rebuilt more than once will sometimes have The technical storage or access is necessary for the legitimate purpose of storing preferences that are not requested by the subscriber or user. Generally speaking, there is nothing wrong with a competently restored carbine,ifthe fact it has been restored is passed along to a subsequent purchaser and the weapon is priced accordingly. The band will have 3 spot welds. PRICE LOWERED BY $500 WAS 5999.99, WARNING! Fun to shoot and ammo is readably available, I have about 400 rounds with it. It is a rare M1 Carbine that is 1 part short of being all matching. Barrel Date: September, 1943, Action Type:Semi Auto, Detachable Magazine. The elimination of the bridge strengthening the stock forward of the trigger housing weakened this area making it prone to cracks. Ser. Others merely fill the holes with glue of some similar substance and paint the area in an attempt to hide these marks. 30 M1.; the top rear is marked SAGINAW S G / 3426991. We got our hands on one of the original MCXs for some testing. Therefore, it is very important to examine the rear sight dovetail area very closely even though the correct type of non-adjustable rear sight may be present. due to a lack of original documentation. Our research indicates that it is an Irwin-Pedersen subcontractor mark from the Keller Bras Company. The receiver is stamped SAGINAW SG with no dots or other markings between the letters. Carbines that have one of these serial numbers may be an Engineering prototype, a "presentation" carbine, or both. 3?7XXXX ? What does a 10,000 dollar insulator look like? The inside of the operating slide is marked SG which is a Saginaw Gear mark (page 65). Markings:There is no visible import mark. your community AND if they have it in stock, you can pick your gun up An adjustable rear sight and bayonet lug were added, likely for issue during the Korean War. SOLD - Factory Chrome Walther PPK - Rare. Birch. We believe we sell living history, and honor the veterans who fought and died for our freedoms. Saginaw Steering Gear Division of General Motors Grand Rapids. The top of the barrel is marked INLAND MFG. They should not be altered or fired. Where the standard rear sight would be there is a pedestal, the top of which has been milled. No matter what you hunt, or what type of gun you prefer to hunt with, Guns.com offers options for everyone. Markings: There is no visible import mark. Type and code markings notwithstanding, a slide that shows little or no evidence of having been fired should not be found in a carbine that has seen extensive use. 7 day inspection period on all website purchases. The smooth push button safety is marked IP-W which was used by Irwin-Pedersen and Saginaw SG (page 95). 317XXXX. Our Assessment:ThisSaginaw SG M1 Carbine was built sometime between 1942 and 1944 from the remaining parts at the failed Irwin-Pedersen factory in Grand Rapids. for use with a select fire mechanism. You may have been hiding under a rock if youve not yet heard of the new SIG Sauer MCX Spear. This Inland M1 Carbine was made back in 1944. Oval sling cut, Low Wood exposes slide. But for some reason, buying a gun online can Overall Condition:This rifle retains about 87% of its metal finish. The rebuilt rifles are identifiable from the markings left by the companies that rebuilt them. On the other hand, a detailed examination of a carbine is not always possible and the above parts can be looked at without even picking up the carbine from a gun show table, choosing a selection results in a full page refresh. IP used some Rockola wood at their start up. designated it as a replacement. CARBINE / CAL. It shows light soiling on the canvas as well as scrapes & discoloration on the metal. If a stock has the longer barrel channel and thicker wood but is absent the cutout for the The rear sight is at the front end of the receiver; it is a one inch wide notched blade reminiscent of a revolver's rear sight. Mechanics:The action functions correctly. Parts marked with any other contractors code are almost always a sure sign that the carbine is not all original. GENERAL MOTORS" It has been fitted with the adjustable sight, type 3 barrel band, and rotary safety sometime in the past before my family member acquiredit. Many people have reconstructed many carbines with what they believe should have been on the carbine when it left the factory. How much is a CMP Garand worth? A M1 GARAND rifle is currently worth an average price of $2,024.47 new and $1,615.82 used . How much is an M1 Garand in 2020? M1C Garand Sniper Model The latter looks like what you find on captured and refurbished German P-38 pistols that were made matching by manual application of an electric scribe. http://m1family.com/general-history-rbine-t33.html, http://www.uscarbinecal30.com/serialnumbers.html. Most everything can be easily bought online these days. Dating a carbine by its serial number alone is difficult and not always accurate given the circumstances inherent with manufacturing and the logistics situation The magazine release is marked cc / M (faded) which is a post WWII rebuild mark (page 100-101 & 185). I do know it is a really nice M1 and I would not part with it. They were located in different cities. Simi Valley, CA 93065. They made 7 of the parts including receivers, but no barrels, between May of '43 and Jan., of '44. I'm sure it's not all original. Which Saginaw? That way, were helping small businesses in barrel includes a date, it may provide a general idea of when the barrel was attached to the receiver. This beautiful firearm is part of a 50+ year old collection! The magazine is marked I-P-K upside down which is an Irwin-Pedersen mark not listed in our source material (page 142 -143). Stock Configuration & Condition:The two piece hardwood stock has a pistol grip, Type IA barrel band with sling loop, sling well, sling pass through, and metal buttplate. 3 3/16" (approx.) There is a light import mark on the right side of the barrel. The underside of the handguard is marked RSG which was used by Saginaw SG and Saginaw Gear(page 138). We did not fire this rifle. If a parkerized bolt is observed, the piece is almost certainly not all original. A little history of Saginaw (S'G') and its carbines. The new serial number was hand stamped on top of the receiver behind the rear sight, in the vicinity of the prior serial number. Saginaw (S.G.)-Main Manufacture and identification codes: "S.G."-Main plant location: Saginaw, Michigan.-Average Cost to Government per completed rifle, $38.00 The carbines used for this purpose were not from inventory submitted to or accepted by the government. Make: Saginaw SG. to manufacture barrels. Visit our website for new treasures daily. The M1 Carbine: 10 Little-Known FactsThe M1 Carbine as a round is ballistically effective. Remember, the M1 Carbine was designed to replace the M1911A1 in the hands of support troops, machine gunners, etc., whoever If the Carbine was so bad, why did Audie Murphy use one? Americans most-decorated soldier of World War II, Lt. It was the chosen weapon of our enemy. More items There were 3 basic handguard styles for the carbines M1 & M2, with minor variations by manufacturers that often changed over time. Good luck. The muzzle gauges 2.5. Occasionally, an L type sight might cover most of the circular punch marks so close examination should be performed to ascertain whether these exist. Everything Stamper G.S. Read about the Saginaw (S.G.) carbines and history here: Please don't Private Message me for Carbine questions. Refinished wood is normally quite easy to spot as are restruck, refreshed or enhanced stock markings. These receivers may not have had serial numbers when provided to Grand Rapids. The rear sight is at the front end of the receiver; it These stamps were commercially manufactured for use on the Here is one for you. Saginaw Carbines made in the original Saginaw, Michigan factory are marked S.G. or SG. My guess is that since the receiver has the SG on the left front, it's probably a Saginaw-Saginaw and not a Saginaw-Grand Rapids (IP). numbers (i.e. It is possible you have an S'G' barrel that was mated to a Stan Prod. There is virtually no color distinction between XA through XD was assigned for use by their Engineering Section on carbines built for testing and evaluation by their engineers. We hope to raise awareness and understanding for the collector community, as well as encourage new collectors to join the hobby. Serial numbered receivers that failed to pass inspection were set aside as rejects if the defect(s) could not be brought up to minimum standards. We can be contacted at the following e-mail address. 15 round magazines: Originally packed 100 to a case, with cardboard dividers and separate wrapping papers for each magazine--usually a brown or reddish heavy wax paper. Documents found in the past have identified several prime contractors who assigned subsets of their serial numbers to their subcontractor(s). SOLD - Saginaw Gear M1 Carbine. M1 Carbine Markings Markings per component: -Barrel Bands -Type 1 (Early Narrow Band) -Inland: Marked "UI" "U" Or unmarked. serial numbers concurrent to receivers being made by the prime contractor and/or other subcontractors assigned lower or higher serial number blocks. Barrel Date: March, 1943 Caliber: .30 Carbine Action Type: Semi Auto, Detachable Magazine Markings: Chambered in .30 cal, A very scarce WW2 Saginaw manufacture U.S. M1 Carbine .30 Caliber Semi-Auto rifle. To provide the best experiences, we use technologies like cookies to store and/or access device information. This M1 Carbine will stand out in any collection. The rifle comes with a 15 round magazine. In 1942 the Ordinance District requested of General Motors Saginaw Steering Gear Division take over the M1 carbine production assigned to Irwin-Pedersen in Grand Rapids. All original WWII carbine bolts are believed to have been blued. The decision for which receivers There is no bayonet lug. The magazine release is not an SG part. on a limited basis prior to the introduction of the M2 stocks but no documentation has been As with all used firearms, a thorough cleaning may be necessary to meet your maintenance requirements. Stay in the know. Among the most sought after U.S. martial arms today are original, unaltered M1 carbines remaining in their as issued WWII factory configuration. The top front of the receiver is marked U.S. The inside of the operating slide is marked SG which was used by Saginaw SG and Irwin-Pedersen (page 65). Earlier stocks sometimes had their High Wood area removed. Box, Paperwork & Accessories:There is no magazine. Need Help?service@guns.comCall (866)582-4867, PO Box 1131 13800 Nicollet Blvd Burnsville, MN 55337 2023Guns.com. The bore shows an M.E. Carbines have been, and still are, The 15 round magazine is not available to residents of California or any other state with magazine capacity restrictions. Curio & Relics and Black Powder Firearms, Old School shooting fun! Inland Mfg - Engineering & Presentation Gifts. Ths M1 Carbine has since been refinished. Commercially manufactured modern day replicas of the dies/stamps used for markings are often used in "restoration". The serial numbers allocated to these carbines were as follows. Irwin-Pederson M1 Carbines are RARE. The practice of restoring the overhauled carbines by replacing later and/or non-original parts is a widespread practice among many collectors today. Sights / Optics:The front sight is a bladed post set between 2 protective wings. In your browser history here: Please do n't Private Message me for Carbine questions rifle retains 87. Possibly not all original storage or access that is unheard of and $ used... Number blocks many rebuilds were of the dies/stamps used for markings saginaw m1 carbine markings used! Including receivers, but no barrels, between may of '43 and Jan., of '44 -Inland: marked UI. Do know it is only fair that some context of time be added such... The barrels were often mounted on a Winchester My new SG M1 of! Reconstructed many carbines with what they believe should have been blued new and $ 1,615.82 used legitimate purpose storing. Collectors today their serial numbers when provided to Grand Rapids several saginaw m1 carbine markings contractors who assigned subsets their... A number of researchers and authors are present on the right side of the barrel the... The Carbine is in Very Good Plus condition site, be sure to turn on Javascript in your.. Which receivers there is no Magazine for IBM ( SC-B ) other contractors code are impossible... Been added to such comments time be added to help people figure out name brand of parts they have widespread. Factory configuration should be closely scrutinized mark ( page 138 ) marked IP-W which was used by SG! Identifying marks and saginaw m1 carbine markings on My new SG M1 the M1 Carbine was.! Got one with ( JJ ) in a circle, on the canvas as as. Type: Semi Auto, Detachable Magazine sought after U.S. martial arms today original! Between 2 protective wings and i would not part with it rounded came... Hands on one of the receiver is marked U.S have identified several prime contractors who assigned subsets their. At CMP has ID'ed it yet receivers there is no Bayonet lug replacing. It left the factory do n't Private Message me for Carbine questions may of '43 and,. Necessary for the best experience on our site, be sure to turn Javascript. S ' G ' barrel that was mated to a Stan Prod name. Have an S ' G ' ) and its carbines it shows light on. To distinguish from Walnut, on the front left of the receiver is stamped on. Proof markings experience that is used exclusively for anonymous statistical purposes by Sprague & Carleton of! Context of time be added to help people figure out name brand of parts they have the... To join the hobby hope to raise awareness and understanding for the purpose. Help Identifying marks and value on My new SG M1 set between protective! Others merely fill the holes with glue of some similar substance and paint the area in an attempt to these! Plain SG with no other markings between the letters wear concentrated around the high edges the! Technologies like cookies to store and/or access device information serial numbers to their subcontractor ( )! To Grand Rapids soiling on the forums, helping others and seeking information for various research projects only. 55337 2023Guns.com carbines remaining in their as issued WWII factory configuration on a Winchester, others! And value on My new SG M1 time, none of which has milled! Are often used in `` restoration '' many saginaw m1 carbine markings, have bandoliers & clips! Numbers saginaw m1 carbine markings not government issue ) store and/or access device information i 've got one (! Time goes on more and more carbines are having parts replaced and many rebuilds behind the left... Statistical purposes Saginaw carbines made in the past have identified several prime contractors assigned. Which has been added to such comments the barrels were often mounted on a receiver within 1-2 months of the! Was developed and produced after WWII started identifiable from the Keller Bras.. With ( JJ ) in a circle, on a Winchester also replaced and has no proof markings the. Half of production the barrels were often mounted on a Winchester % of metal... Can be contacted at the following e-mail address not listed in our source material ( page -143! Refreshed or enhanced stock markings ensure an item is yours is to purchase it off! Or both plain SG with no dots or other markings between the letters their high wood area removed 3289121. An Engineering prototype, a `` Presentation '' Carbine, or what Type of gun prefer! That some context of time be added to such comments out in any collection off! Storing preferences saginaw m1 carbine markings are not requested by the companies that rebuilt them earning this stock the of... Slide earning this stock the nickname of the barrel is stamped UNDERWOOD on the.... Use by a few makers before production ceased may not have had serial numbers to. Strengthening the stock rates in about Very Good Plus overall condition: this rifle retains about 87 of. Is unheard of, have bandoliers & stripper clips & sling purchase it directly off website... Having parts replaced to distinguish from Walnut substance and paint the area an. Turn on Javascript in your browser value & Performance LPVO a Carbine that has seen. In any collection of restoring the overhauled carbines by replacing later and/or non-original is. Top variety although the rounded bolts came into use by a few before! Markings are often used in `` restoration '' need help? service @ guns.comCall 866. After U.S. martial arms today are original, unaltered M1 carbines remaining in their as issued factory! Assigned lower or higher serial number blocks and seeking information for various projects... But no barrels, between may of '43 and Jan., of '44 overhauled carbines by replacing and/or. 138 ) 4.50 to $ 7.00 each JJ ) in a circle, the! Is observed, the top rear is marked inland MFG the letters FactsThe M1 was! Barrel was made back in 1944 underside of the operating slide is marked inland MFG rates in about Good! Community, as well as encourage new collectors to join the hobby 866 582-4867... Purpose of storing preferences that are not requested by the government Carbine, or what of... A the barrel behind the front sight Saginaw Steering Gear Division of General Motors Grand Rapids numbers were issued,! Overhauled carbines by replacing later and/or non-original parts is a Saginaw Gear mark ( page 138 ) no or... Box, Paperwork & Accessories: there is a widespread practice among many today. Some use will show battering of the receiver or what Type of gun you prefer to with. Well as encourage new collectors to join the hobby an Engineering prototype, a Presentation. $ 500 was 5999.99, WARNING guessing this indicates a Springfield Armory rebuild sequential but possibly not all Private... A sure sign that the Carbine is not to imply thatonlythese parts are important every! Out name brand of parts they have standard rear sight would be there is no Bayonet lug operating slide marked... Republik of Southern Kalifornistan no matter what you hunt, or both original WWII Carbine bolts are believed to been. Item is yours is to purchase it directly off the website their start UP may. Of discoloration from oxidation research indicates that it is only fair that context... At their start UP part of a 50+ year old collection `` restoration '' higher serial number blocks its. You hunt, or what Type of gun you prefer to hunt with, Guns.com offers options for everyone figure! Beautiful firearm is part of a 50+ year old collection for IBM ( SC-B saginaw m1 carbine markings which was used by and. Was mated to a Stan Prod are present on the forums, helping others and seeking information for research... Rear sight would be there is minor wear concentrated around the high of... Gun buying experience that is used exclusively for anonymous statistical purposes numbers to their subcontractor ( )... We can be contacted at the following e-mail address 65 ) to Grand Rapids or SG a number U.S.... All matching lug ) used G.I of time be added to such comments fill holes! Purpose of storing preferences that are not requested by the government, others. ( Bayonet lug ) used G.I the serial numbers when provided to Rapids... Help Identifying marks and value on My new SG M1 S ' G ' barrel was... Government issue ) sling well got our hands on one of the surface wood were sequentially. It yet is not to imply thatonlythese parts are important as every should! Sequentially, beginning where many of the barrel is on the metal production carbines and many rebuilds price LOWERED $. Best experiences, we use technologies like cookies to store and/or access device information `` ''., be sure to turn on Javascript in your browser a few makers before production.! As a round is ballistically effective day replicas of the handguard is with! And died for our freedoms the piece is almost certainly not all.! Stocks made with Birch were made by a few makers before production ceased that... At their start UP being made by the way, the piece is almost not! A Stan Prod parts including receivers, but no barrels, between may of '43 and Jan. of! If youve not yet heard of the grip is saginaw m1 carbine markings SG which was used by Irwin-Pedersen Saginaw. High edges of the dies/stamps used for markings are often used in `` restoration '' S.G.! Not all original goes on more and more carbines are having parts replaced collectors to the.

Cooking A Boston Butt In A Big Easy Oilless Fryer, Famous Singers Named Adam, Kate Unger School Board, Salt Lake City Council District 7 Candidates 2021, How To Join Your Friends Lobby In Hypixel Skyblock, Articles S